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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    325

    Volume of a 160 CF cylinder?

    Can anyone tell me the actual internal volume of a typical 160 CF high pressure cylinder? My argon cylinder is nominally 8" diameter and about 48" tall. Adjusting for the dished bottom and the rounded top and not knowing the thickness my back of the envelope calculation comes about 1.2 CF internal capacity. That would result in about 2000 psia for a full cylinder. I don't recall what it measured when "full" but it was close to that I think.

    I have about 300 psia left and was wanting to future out how much gas was left.

    TIA,

    Ken

  2. #2
    Roger Guest
    For HP cylinder for gas that doesn't change to liquid in cylinder or Acetylene

    Max working pressure stamped on cylinder in PSI plus 10% is maximum pressure allowed in new HP cylinder.
    Max WP New Cylinder in PSIG divide by 14.7= ATM +1 = ATA (pressure in atmospheres absolute)
    Cubic foot rating of cylinder divide by ATA above = floodable volume of cylinder.

    Gage pressure is pressure above atmospheric pressure 2000 psi is assumed to be 2000 psig + 14.7psi = 2014.7 psia (pounds square inch absolute which includes atmospheric pressure).

    Metric BAR = 14.5 psi which is metric version of ATM pressure unit.
    Last edited by Roger; 03-16-2012 at 12:09 PM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    325
    Thanks Roger. I did not find a max pressure stamped on the cylinder. It might be under the Argon label which I did not feel like scraping off. That said...

    If the volume of gas I am purchasing, 160 Standard CF (measured at one atmosphere) requires the cylinder to be filled to its "new" rating... can that much gas be placed in an "old" cylinder which presumably would have a lower pressure limit?

    I guess when it is empty I could remove the valve, get a measuring cup and fill it with water, then drain it, replace the valve and exchange it. Of course the LWS might be a little pissed when they find they have a damp cylinder Besides, that sounds too much like work. I will ask the LWS what the floodable volume is when I exchange it.

    Ken

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    5,636
    You're looking at somewhere around 20-25 CF left if it's a 160 CF cylinder. That's based on the formula posted and the chart in my old copy of The Oxy-Acetylene Handbook (2nd Edition).
    --- RJL ----------------------------------------------

    Ordinarily I'm insane, but I have lucid moments when I'm merely stupid.
    -------------------------
    DialArc 250 (1974), Idealarc 250 (1971), SyncroWave 250 w/Coolmate 3, SP-175+, TA 161STL,
    Lincwelder AC180C (circa 1952), Victor & Smith's O/A, Dayton (Miller) spot welder, 1200 sq.ft. of garage filled with crap and a kid that can actually run the stuff +++

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    325
    Thanks usmcpop, that is about what I was guessing. I guess I will do some practicing to use it up rather than wait to get in the middle of a project and have to stop and make a LONG run to the LWS who is not so local.

    Ken

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    5,636
    That old Oxy-Acet handbook is a good resource. Got it from a used book seller on-line for about $7 delivered, in like-new condition. It's from Linde, back in the day.

    I knew I had seen a graph in there with the amount of fill based on pressure. I grabbed the book, stabbed a finger in the middle, then grabbed another 1/4" of pages with my thumb and opened it up. Low and behold, I hit the exact page I was looking for! Weird.
    --- RJL ----------------------------------------------

    Ordinarily I'm insane, but I have lucid moments when I'm merely stupid.
    -------------------------
    DialArc 250 (1974), Idealarc 250 (1971), SyncroWave 250 w/Coolmate 3, SP-175+, TA 161STL,
    Lincwelder AC180C (circa 1952), Victor & Smith's O/A, Dayton (Miller) spot welder, 1200 sq.ft. of garage filled with crap and a kid that can actually run the stuff +++

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    1,245
    Quote Originally Posted by usmcpop View Post
    That old Oxy-Acet handbook is a good resource. Got it from a used book seller on-line for about $7 delivered, in like-new condition. It's from Linde, back in the day.

    I knew I had seen a graph in there with the amount of fill based on pressure. I grabbed the book, stabbed a finger in the middle, then grabbed another 1/4" of pages with my thumb and opened it up. Low and behold, I hit the exact page I was looking for! Weird.
    Any chance you could post a copy of the graph? That would be handy, for me.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    5,636
    This is for one of their larger cylinders but you can proportion it.

    Linde chart.jpg
    --- RJL ----------------------------------------------

    Ordinarily I'm insane, but I have lucid moments when I'm merely stupid.
    -------------------------
    DialArc 250 (1974), Idealarc 250 (1971), SyncroWave 250 w/Coolmate 3, SP-175+, TA 161STL,
    Lincwelder AC180C (circa 1952), Victor & Smith's O/A, Dayton (Miller) spot welder, 1200 sq.ft. of garage filled with crap and a kid that can actually run the stuff +++

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    1,245
    Quote Originally Posted by usmcpop View Post
    This is for one of their larger cylinders but you can proportion it.

    Linde chart.jpg
    Thanks! One of the things I have to do from time to time, is estimate the amount of gas used in a particular welding or cutting operation when temperatures vary, and this will help me to eliminate some of the guess-work.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    731
    Quote Originally Posted by taylorkh View Post
    Thanks Roger. I did not find a max pressure stamped on the cylinder. It might be under the Argon label which I did not feel like scraping off. That said...


    Ken
    Maximim working pressure will be stamped into tank... Look for "DOT- 3AA-2265" (or something very similar).... Tank max working pressure is 2265 psi...

    Go to this page and click on "High Pressure Cylinders" to get tank specifications (size/weight/volume/pressure)...

    http://www.worthingtoncylinders.com/...-Products.aspx

    Download (or open) the file "HighPress.pdf"


    Dale

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