several questions about torch and hose

[michos]

I just got an OA cutting setup used. Unfortunately I wasnt able to look at it before purchasing. Still think I got a good deal on the tanks, but im completely new to OA usage so ive got a few questions that someone might be
able to help with.

First off, the hose looks super old. Its cracked all over the place. If it doesnt have a leak, is it still safe and fine to use?

Secondly, in my first attempts to cut metal with the torch a few things happened:
1. I had a hard time getting a neutral flame at first. It seemed that I could crank the oxygen all the way up and down and not get a proper flame. The next time I tried, after closing it all off and starting again, I was able to get a neutral flame just fine. Third time, had trouble once again. Any idea what might be the problem? Is my oxy psi not set high enough perhaps?

2. When I cut, the flame goes all the way through and seems to make a decent cut, but after my torch passes the area, the metal continues to bubble and, to some extent, melt back together. Why is this? Do I need another tip for the torch? Is it cutting too hot?

Many thanks for your help

[Blacksmith]

I'm far from an expert, but I can imagine if the hose is all cracked outside, it may be cracked and swollen inside too, so some new hose might help. You didn't state the pressures or tip size you're using and they vary somewhat with the torch and tip size. It sounds like the dross is closing back up behind your cut; could be traveling too slowly, a worn tip not giving a nice jet to blow it clear, or as you seem to suspect, too low an oxygen pressure. I'm pretty sure if your center flame changes when you hit the cutting lever you don't have enough oxygen flow to the torch head, be it from low pressure or collasping hoses.

Post some details on your tip size and current pressures and I'm sure someone will be along to help you.

[gwiley]

Buy some new hoses - cheap at Tractor Supply. A leaking OA hose can kill you or burn down your shop in short order, not an area to save $40 on.

I am sure you are already thinking along these lines:

Make sure the tip orifices are clean. Crud in the orifices can make the cone rough or very hard to define.

A few tips To find neutral flame:

Turn up acet. until soot stops appearing in flame
Add Oxy. SLOWLY until you see the cone, it is easy to move too fast.

If it adjusts poorly you may want to replace the torch body or have it rebuilt - might have been abused.

[michos]

IMG_2213.jpgIMG_2215.jpgIMG_2216.jpgIMG_2218.jpgIMG_2219.jpg

Ive attached some photos of the hose, torch, tip, and cut metal. Size of the tip is 1-1-101. Im not yet very familiar with what size is correct for each thickness. Im about to start on a project where I will primarily be cutting 1/4". What size tip would you recommend for this project?

As for the photo of the cut, disregard the fact that its far from a straight line. haha. I was just trying to get it to actually cut. You can see how the metal just bubbled and came back together. I was going pretty fast so im not sure speed was the issue. This particular metal was 3/16.

[michos]

IMG_2221.jpg Here is a photo of the cut metal

[rlarkin]

You did not state what kind of "DEAL" you got, but it looks to me like the hose and torch body are toast.

Are the bottles "customer owned"?

What regulator settings are you using.
The cut looks like the oxy is set to low and not blowing out the dross.
Once the cut gets started the flame is no longer needed. The cutting is done by the oxy.

[michos]

I paid 350 for the full setup including a 250 oxy tank and a 145 acetylene tank, regulators, hose and torch. Tanks are in good condition and ive already swapped them out at the welding shop for full ones. I figured it was a decent deal given the price of the tanks but yea, im not too happy that the hose and torch are in such rugged condition. Did I get screwed on that deal? I bought from a friend of a good friend so I can give him **** if I did.

Im running it with 5psi for the acetylene and 10-20psi for the oxy. Its hard to get a good read on the oxy though as it seems to float around a lot when adjusting the turning fly valve. I'll make sure that the tip is clean and work on adjusting the oxy. Any other suggestions?

Many thanks

[rlarkin]

For 350 I would say you got a good deal on the tanks. That size, and customer owned, will be pricey.
If the regs float they need to be replaced, and or rebuilt.
10psi is too low for cutting that thickness. I set mine at 20 on the oxy for up to 1/4".

BTW. Don't give you friend any ****. He did treat you right on the bottles.
Just tell him you decided to replace the rest of the setup so you could continue to be his friend.

[michos]

Thanks for the info. The torch is also popping randomly. It popped once before I pushed the cutting lever while I was heating the metal and once after I had turned both tanks off. It clearly has a leak as a small flame hovers at the tip even after turning the acetylene valve off. So here is the question:
Its a victor torch so its a good brand but, given the info and the photos of the torch, is it worth trying to fix it/get it fixed or should I not even bother and just buy a whole new set up?

If i should get a new setup, is there one in the $150 range you would recommend? Also, what size tip should I be using on 1/4" metal.

Many thanks for the help

[usmcpop]

The Victor "Firepower 250" kit goes for about $160. delivered. It does have flash arrestors/reverse flow valves. http://store.cyberweld.com/viwecuou.html

The Harbor Freight 98958 is a clone of a medium Victor torch and sometimes goes on sale for as low as $90.

http://www.harborfreight.com/oxygen-...kit-98958.html

Of course, Hobart has a nice kit: http://www.hobartwelders.com/product...m-duty-outfit/

[gwiley]

From the pictures you posted it looks to me as though the torch body and hose should be taken out of service. Victor cutting tip charts are all over the net - try:

http://www.airgas.com/content/detail...=7000000000128

Depending on your technique a 00 or 0 size tip will do the trick. For 1/4 I'd vote for 0, just go easy on the fuel gas.

A clean cut depends on you moving as fast as possible without loosing the cut - as you slow down you overheat the metal and make a mess. If you are struggling try tilting the tip back a few degrees so that some of the pre-heat will be forward of the cut.

[michos]

Just wanted to give a final update on all of this.
I went to the local welding store here and the consensus was that I was likely using a tip that was too large for the 1/4" metal I was cutting and that the popping was likely due to low psi on my regulators. I got a victor 00 to replace the size 1 that was on the torch and I cranked up the psi up to 7 acetylene and 35 oxygen. This worked well and the torch is cutting metal like a pro. My only concern now is with the hose which I will replace shortly and the fact that the torch seems to have a slow leak. I'll probably replace the torch sometime in the near future anyways as it is super long and, im told, is designed for scrapping metal as you can cut near the ground while standing.

[monckywrench]

Looks like a Victor ST style which are a breeze to rebuild, have rebuilt or install fresh seals.

im told, is designed for scrapping metal as you can cut near the ground while standing.

You were told incorrectly.
That length is excellent for making smooth straight cuts and is NOT a "long" torch. Many welders prefer straight torches for cutting. Practice making six to eight inch cuts on scrap. We trained new students doing that for most of a day.

I don't consider that torch to be "rough" at all. Patina isn't damage, and tip nuts are cheap if you want a pretty one. Brass doesn't stay pretty. The dents in the handle aren't near deep enough to hit the internal gas tubes on that design.

http://www.thermadyne.com/victor/res...&categoryID=25

A bucket of clean water works nicely for leak checks. "Popping" is often due to loose tip seating. I manually rotate tips a few times then tighten with a wrench if they don't seat with a firm manual twist of the nut.

It clearly has a leak as a small flame hovers at the tip even after turning the acetylene valve off.

I tighten the knob FIRMLY by hand, then while holding the torch body with my left hand I swat the knob firmly with a clean piece of wood etc square to the knob so as not to bend the shaft. Victor ball-tip valves are very durable, and the ball can often refresh the seat surface this way. If no workee, valves are reasonable. Use genuine Victor.

Worst case, a professional rebuild is about 75 dollars and I'd have your Victor torch done instead of buying some offshore "grenade".
You'll get it back nice and shiny.

Avoid buying "clone" torches except Uniweld. They LOOK like good torches but seals and machining are often poor.

I destroy those I get in Ebay lots rather than resell them, hence the drill holes in the example below.

Pictured is an understandably nameless offshore Victor copy which failed due to poor seals disintegrating.

Though it obviously has little use, the O-rings on the cutting attachment fell off in chunks. The welding tip mixer included sustained a fire, and there was only ash left of those seals. I tested it outdoors with Victor O-rings but then the cutting tip wouldn' t seat in the head due to poor machining. It popped like popcorn .

junk.jpg

[michos]

Many thanks for that very helpful information. Im not concerned with the look of the torch - if it works well and is not a hazard, im happy. Good to know about it not being for scrapping metal. Im totally new to oxy acetylene so if my cuts aren't straight, id definitely buy that its not the torch's fault.

As for the hose, i saw a 25fter on ebay new for 28. Seems quite cheap. Are there "good" hoses and "bad" hoses or are they all basically the same?

[Blacksmith]

Please bear in mind that you are dealing with a fuel gas that can burn at several thousand degrees with just air and a powerful oxidizer. An old hand demostrated the power of oxygen to me by putting a freshly light cigarette on a cutting tip and pulling the cutting lever. There was a flash and the entire cigarette (100 mm) was gone except for some of the filter. I do not recommend trying this, but the lesson has stuck with me for 20 years. Consider the cost of an acetylene fed fire or oxygen accelerated fire when pricing your replacement hoses. I'd like a O/A outfit, but having survived one garage fire, caused by the failure of a fireplace that backed up into the attached garage, I'm seriously thinking of waiting until I get my dream home with the detached garage. Then, if despite being careful I have an accident, at least I'll have someplace to stay after the fire department leaves.