multi plaz ?

[garage built]

Recentley I stumbled upon a an ad for this thing called a multi plaz. They were showing all sorts of operations welding brazing soldering cutting and welding. As near as I could get out of what literature I could find was it was using water and alchahol (at least 40%) turning it to steam and then to plasma. Sometimes my glass is 1/2 full and am kind of shy of the product. The closest dealer seems to be in Cali. Anyone know anything?

[billbong]

Hi Garage Built, I saw that "machine" too.

I was browsing Ebay and saw an add at the bottom for a plasma cutter with welding, brazing, soldering and cutting capabilities.

The company also had a couple of videos demo-ing the capabilities of the torch.....pretty awesome range of features.

Some years ago, about 1997, I was working part time for a guy just before I retired permanently, and I got to use a plasma cutter for the first time in my life.

I was intrigued by the fact that you could generate a hot flame by an electrical process and cut through steel etc, which got me thinking....what if you could somehow make a torch like that, and be able to do brazing and "gas type welding" without the need for Oxy and Acetylene bottles and the cost of hiring and filling them.....well now about 12 years later they've done it.....the Multiplaz 3500.

The bonus is there's no compressor needed, like the plasma cutter needs, it's all in the torch body and all it takes is some water in the torch body to generate the steam for arc plasma concentration.

In my book, the biggy is the ability to weld Stainless Steel and Alluminium without the need for Argon or any shielding gas at all

I see the price in the USA is about $1,995, and down in OZ it's $2,450.

If'n I can sell a bit of the junk in my garage and sell all my welding gear too I'll "invest" in one of these machines.....so many features it leaves me panting...and to top it off it runs on 110volts or 240 volts house current not industrial, and is completely portable.

Who needs Tig, Mig or stick, or as well an Oxy Acetylene set-up
Ian.

[monckywrench]

Do conduct a thorough test for your own self-protection including destructive bend testing of samples.

Who needs Tig, Mig or stick, or as well an Oxy Acetylene set-up

Not I. Advertisers ALWAYS tell the truth.

Everyone do the moral thing and send me your antiquated equipment for proper ecologically-sound disposal. You pay shipping and handling. Those nasty Red and Blue welding machines are particularly super-extra obsolete, and copper windings emit toxic homotrons when powered up!

Pack neatly with all accessories so none of you are tempted to aid and abet the use of other obsolete machines.

[urch55]

Those nasty Red and Blue welding machines are particularly super-extra obsolete, and copper windings emit toxic homotrons when powered up!

I would question the copper part... My 1983 Miller TB has aluminum windings.

BTW,, what is "homotrons" anyway???? Sounds like something to do with 'gay' marriage.

[usmcpop]

I think back then, Miller used only the finest "alyoominium" from the Queen's private stock in Great Britain.

And "homotrons" are similarly charged particles that are, somewhat strangely, attracted to each other.

[urch55]

And "homotrons" are similarly charged particles that are, somewhat strangely, attracted to each other.

So then, I can see where that fits in a marrage.

[monckywrench]

I would question the copper part... My 1983 Miller TB has aluminum windings.

Aluminum ingestion has been linked to osteoporosis.

Send the aluminum-winding machines too, so no one accidentally gnaws on them (like lead paint chips).

Safety First!

[billbong]

Heh Heh, I like the idea of sending all those "obsolete" carefully packed welders to someone who will "recycle" them eco friendly....I didn't think Ebay was an Eco friendly site.....anyway, the Multiplaz 3500 thing.....I went to our local agent at Alltools in Dandenong (Australia), to get a hands on look at the device.

It's super compact and without doubt so far up the technology ladder it makes me giddy.

They quoted me a price of $........shh....going to try and get a better deal by getting my mate to have a look at one too.....but I can say it was a lot better than the $2,400 I got quoted previously in Sydney NSW.

I think I'll go and get a demo arranged this week to see the actual performance first hand, then I'll go and flog all my Tig, Mig Stick and spot welder stuff and return the Argon gas bottle and cancel the rental.

I haven't got a Plasma cutter, so that will be another toy to mess with......it cuts 30mm thick steel plate like butter, correction, (must read the script)...it will melt a hole through 30mm....and using a 240 volt 16 amp single phase domestic supply...WOW.....it even cuts Stainless Steel like it was paper....double WOW.....I think I'm going to have an organism I'm so excited.

As soon as I get some more performance info I'll post an opinion as I see it.
Ian.

[urch55]

WOW.....I think I'm going to have an organism I'm so excited.

Just make sure the unit is turned off and unplugged before having one..

[jimcolt]

I wouldn't go selling of all your equipment just yet....untill you try one of these units out! If your read through the spec there are some pretty wild claims and comparisons. The one that I tried was able to barely sever some 1/8" thick stainless.....and barely 1/4" on steel in the cutting mode. And...the claim that it uses only 2500 watts of power indicates that is has about the same power as a 20 amp plasma system....which are generally rated for about a maximum of 1/4" cutting.

An interesting quote from one of the testimonials on the site claims that the unit uses less power than 3 - 100 watt light bulbs....they also state that a 100W light bulb consumes 1 kW of power......which is 1000 watts! In reality it uses that same amount of power as 25 - 100 wattlight bulbs......I'm not so sure I would trust many of their claims. I could not find any pictures of it cutting any heavy plate....nor any good technical explanation of how it works.

Jim

[usmcpop]

They spec power required at 3.5 "kWt" at 220V and 2.0 "kWt" at 110V. ???

Cutting up to 3/8" ...

http://www.multiplaz.com/specifications

[billbong]

Hmmmmm, I went to the agents near my place, Alltools Australia, and the guy there says that he demoed the unit and it cut 30mm thick steel plate no problem...........until I see a demo I'll take anything the sales mob say with a bit of caution....Correction...he said it melted a hole through the 30mm plate.

If'n the demo turns out OK, I'll probably sell the other gear I've got, but definately not until the unit proves itself 100%.

The present set-up with my Champion welder attachment and Coppermate 200 amp welder doing Mig Tig Stick and and a lot more is working OK, so I'm not in too much of a hurry.

I also emailed the people in USA about the errors in the specification description, and they said the specs were compiled from the previous unit, a 2500 model, and needed to be "tidied up".

The biggest attribute I can see is the ability to weld and cut steel, stainless and alluminium without having to have Argon and renting bottles etc, and the sheer compact size of the unit.....in the cutting mode it doesn't need a compressor to supply the air for cutting either, so really very portable if not only compact.

Professionals will naturally be much closer to the weld specs and even Kosher welding equipment is a divided camp quality wise when it comes to laying down a bead.

The comparison might be as in a super Tig, as the weld is created with a filler rod as opposed to Mig or stick which lays down a continuous metal layer as you work.

It all sounds very impressive, but years ago when I had my first go with a Plasma, I wondered if'n the Plasma torch could be adapted to be used as a gas type torch, somehow, thereby cutting out the Oxy/Acetylene bottle need, so here it is, all bells and whistles, no gas whatever not even compressed air, and an 8,000 deg C pin point flame.

With that temperature, I wonder if'n you could melt old Tungsten Carbide tips to do super hard facing....if'n it's possible, a whole new ball game is possible.
Ian.

[usmcpop]

It's an amazing device, no doubt. However, it it were either that amazing or nearly perfected, I'd expect any of the existing plasma cutting outfits (or welding companies) to jump all over it. I have see all of one review by an auto mechanic guy who doesn't apparently know the wattage of a light bulb.

Call Myth Busters and see if they'll have a go at it!

[billbong]

Good advice......but I'm committed mentally to buy the outfit.....just like having another look at that car you have eating a hole in your brain.....I gotta have it.

I've weighed up the odds....and am getting a demo and hands on trial next week, so pending the outcome of the capabilities it's green for go.

I base the features in order of preference (for me) :-

1st, you can do a whole lot of very special welding without the need for expensive shielding gas and bottle rental.....providing....it works.
2nd, You can plasma cut without the need for a compressor banging away....providing....it works.
3rd, you can do all the functions listed by the manufacturers without having to have a number of welding machines eg Mig, Tig and Oxy/Acetylene bottles .... providing....it works.
4th, I like Tig welding for sheer control of the heat and precise welding properties that only Tig can do.
5th, Welding cast iron with cast iron filler becomes highly desirable, no special rods.
6th, if the guy in the video demoes can do it, so can I...(I hope).
7th, I won't have to worry about blunt Tungstens ever again.
8th, consumeables are the very minimal.

The last reason, which is the most important..... I want it, because I've played with all my old toys!

For me, it represents a freedom to plug in switch on and go to town without having to check to see if'n I've still got some gas left in the bottle or worry about if'n the gas flow is sufficient from economising on flow rate.

There's a tendency when Migging or Tigging to want to reduce the shielding gas flow rate, but having the porosity after a weld is a downside, so having no gas is a biggy.

Alluminium welding without special requirements for car engine parts suddenly takes on a whole new ball game, as I recently paid out $200 for a water pump housing for my old Mercedes Benz, and the one at the wreckers wasn't much better.

There's also one other big advantage too when cutting.

Normally you need a very dry clean air supply with a de-humidifier....but in this torch you actually have water and water/alcohol present during the cutting and welding ops......so no expensive de-humidifier in the air line (no air line).
Ian.

[billbong]

BTW, in the Multiplaz video dems, did anyone notice the way the guy "set-up" the work pieces prior to welding?

He didn't....that is, he just laid two pieces of metal plate on the weld bench, attached earth lead and went and welded them.....parts were not clamped to prevent distortion or bending.

One of the reasons is that the heat from the gun is very intense, 8,000 deg C, and localised, 10 times hotter than an Oxy/acetylene flame, so the heat is localised right in the weld area, very little dissipation.

He welded Copper too, which by it's rapid conduction properties is the very pitts to keep from distorting.....also no clamping.

It's starting to look very good.
Ian.