Self shield fluxcore welds: first time

[Dan]

The wife doesn t care about this that much anymore, because she assumes that I can pretty much weld with anything. So Im going to show this to you guys.

Saturday afternoon, I had my first real experience running a self shielded fluxcore wire. I was running an .030 Hobart Fabshield 23 (E71T-GS) on some 12 ga. The joint design was a T joint. After 3 welds I was able to produce beads similar to the pics that I am attaching to this post. I was amazed at the level of smoke residue and spatter that was left on the material after the bead. However, I was very happy to see how easily a wire wheel on my angle grinder removed all of this. Anyway here are the pictures. They aren t that bad for a first time are they?

[Dan]

To prove that the first one wasn t a fluke here is one more.

[GWOL]

yea Dan, thats what mine looked like after the first attempt! NOT :)

[Dan]

Sorry about that I lost my internet connection. So hopefully here is the second picture.

[Rocky D]

Originally posted by Dan
Sorry about that I lost my internet connection. So hopefully here is the second picture.

Dan, I have noticed that when pulling the weld, the flux covers the weld all over nicely, and when I push the weld, the flux kinda falls over to both side of the weld, and leaves no flux in the middle. Have you noticed the same results when pushing the weld?

I'm presently doiing a six inch pipe job at work with my MM130XP, using .035" FCAW and getting some great results. ER71T-11 wire.
My research tells me that FCAW is a viable alternative for E7018 stick electrode. I'll post some pictures tomorrow.

[bitternut]

Rocky D

What brand of .035" fluxcore wire are you using? I really like Fabshield 21B but I am only able to find it in .030" diameter. I have had to resort to using the Lincoln .035" wire which is much stiffer and doesn't seem to run as nice a bead as the Fabshield. I think you mentioned in a previous post that you used Fabshield E71T-11.

[Rocky D]

Originally posted by bitternut
Rocky D

What brand of .035" fluxcore wire are you using? I really like Fabshield 21B but I am only able to find it in .030" diameter. I have had to resort to using the Lincoln .035" wire which is much stiffer and doesn't seem to run as nice a bead as the Fabshield. I think you mentioned in a previous post that you used Fabshield E71T-11.

My fave is any Hobart wire...I've run all sorts, and Hobart still runs best. At present, I have some Lincoln wire, and some Esab.

[Dan]

Originally posted by Rocky D


Dan, I have noticed that when pulling the weld, the flux covers the weld all over nicely, and when I push the weld, the flux kinda falls over to both side of the weld, and leaves no flux in the middle. Have you noticed the same results when pushing the weld?

I'm presently doiing a six inch pipe job at work with my MM130XP, using .035" FCAW and getting some great results. ER71T-11 wire.
My research tells me that FCAW is a viable alternative for E7018 stick electrode. I'll post some pictures tomorrow.

Rocky,

I havent tried pushing the puddle, because my understanding was that I was suppose to pull the weld with a self shielded fluxcore. Well I guess to run vertical up I ll have to push it won t I?

I just found a roll of .030 Hobart E71T-11 in my inventory, so Im going to remove the E71T-GS from my machine and give the E71T-11 a try . According to the Lincoln handbook this wire classification is suppose to have a smooth spray type arc. Is there less spatter and smoke with this wire? I guess ill find out soon enough. By the way I removed the nozzle off the end of the gun. Is this the procedure that you follow too? Can t wait to see your pics. This stuff has hooked right know its a new challenge. Do you or anyone else have any sample vertical up welds to show me. This is going to be my next step in educating myself about this wire. What oscillation technique do you prefer for vertical up with it?

[Rocky D]

This is a section of pipe with a butterfly valve I will be inserting into a six inch hot water pipe run from our co-generation plant.

It is entirely welded with ER71T-11, .035" wire with a Miller 130XP 120v MIG machine.

I show in subsequent pictures, various components that are going to be installed in this pipe run also

[Rocky D]

All the welding was done on a Aronson weld positioner, which all the welds are in the vertical position as the pipe turned on the positioner.

By doing it inthis manner, I kept the flux from getting ahead of the puddle.

[Rocky D]

As a precaution, I heliarced the inside, however, with a 1/8" gap, I was able to acheive 100% penetration.

[Rocky D]

This is a "weldolet" weldeed to a flange. Notice the little buttons I heliarced on the mating edge t give me a gap when I install it on the existing pipe run. I'm going to be up in the air, so I figured this would be easier to maintain the gap, than to use a rod for the gap.

[Rocky D]

I dye penetrant tested them to be sure there's no voids. Dye on the inside...let it set for 15 minutes then spray the developer on the out side....any 'blood' showing means a quick repair. They were good to go.

[Rocky D]

When I cut the pipe I don't want it to move in case there is a preload on it, so I will weld this frame on first, then cut the pipe.

In the back you can see the rest of the weldolets I'm going to use.

[Rocky D]

This is a frame that I will clamp across the flanges on the valve assembly to lift it into position with a forklift. The pipe run is horizontal.

Corner clamps make it easy to maintain dimension and squareness. Then I tack the ends and corners of the joint to hold it for welding.

[Rocky D]

This illustrates it better

[Rocky D]

I'm going to try to get more pictures as the job progresses, and you will see the weird places I have to crawl into, and how these parts fit on the pipes.

I realize this is old hat to you old timers, but I just thought the newbies would benefit from something on this project.

[ZACHV]

I am not familar with Heliarc welding, but I am curious as to why you would choose that process over something else just for the interior welds.

Nice project BTW. Those weld beads on the exterior of the pipe--was that one pass or two?

[Rocky D]

Originally posted by ZACHV
I am not familar with Heliarc welding, but I am curious as to why you would choose that process over something else just for the interior welds.

Nice project BTW. Those weld beads on the exterior of the pipe--was that one pass or two?


Heliarc = TIG = GTAW. Where a tungsten electrode greats the heat, and melts the base metal, to which a filler rod is introduced to make the weld. It it easy to seal up any voids that may not have filled in from the opposite side or out side welding of the pipe. it insures there are no leaks. Now when I weld the pipe flange assembly in place I won't be able to do that, so my welds have to be good.

Three passes...keyholed root, second fill pass ,and weaved cover pass.

[ZACHV]

Sooo...helirc is the same as TIG?? I never know that. I figured it was similar, but thought it was more "precise" for lack of a better term.

[Ed Heimbach]

Rocky;
How do you manage to get time to post all of this? I only can squeeze 24 hours into each day, and I still am trying to get more.
Maybe I need to quit my fab shop, sell my mobile rigs, and get a job at the paper mill( then I'll only be on call 12 hours a day!)
Seriously,I love a nice pipe job when I can get it, as I worked in the gas fields in the '80s,and we were putting pipe lines everywhere(another 84 hour per week job, loved the O.T.).
When you do something so much that you dream of it at night, you can't help but get good at it!
Nice pics, I'd like to post some of my stuff, but lately I've been doing alot of repair on quarry equipment and the parent company won't allow any photos to be taken for publication(some legal thing)

[Rocky D]

Originally posted by Ed Heimbach
Rocky;
How do you manage to get time to post all of this? I only can squeeze 24 hours into each day, and I still am trying to get more.
Maybe I need to quit my fab shop, sell my mobile rigs, and get a job at the paper mill( then I'll only be on call 12 hours a day!)
Seriously,I love a nice pipe job when I can get it, as I worked in the gas fields in the '80s,and we were putting pipe lines everywhere(another 84 hour per week job, loved the O.T.).
When you do something so much that you dream of it at night, you can't help but get good at it!
Nice pics, I'd like to post some of my stuff, but lately I've been doing alot of repair on quarry equipment and the parent company won't allow any photos to be taken for publication(some legal thing)

Hi Ed,

Yeah, the legal thing.... don't take pictures of our main product, so I feel justified.;)

You would probably be the one to ask... how do you do a hot tap on a 2 to 6 inch gas line? What's is the procedure? I 'm not doing one, yet, but I've always wanted to know.

[Ed Heimbach]

Rocky;
Hot taps, wow, how I hated those things!
I was usually on compressor stations, building manifolds and such, and didn't get to do much on charged lines. From time to time though, I helped a real old timer who was the hot tapper's hot tapper.
Depending on line size, either a saddle was welded on to the main, or a 't' was split, and then welded on, then a short section of pipe was welded to that fitting, with a flange connecting to another 't'. On this was a fitting for a hole saw which was used to cut through to main.
Done properly, not much gas excaped, a few times tooling problems made need for a 'stack', where a section of pipe was setup like a chimney, as the gas was conducted up it and then burned off. That was the part I didn't like.
Needless to say welding into the main wasn't fun ,either, for one burn through was all you needed, and then you were in a world of 'stuff'.
Hope you found this 'enlightening'. Ed

[Rocky D]

Here's a shot of me at the job site. OSHA would flip if they saw how we did this! :D

My helper first drilles a 1/4" hole to see if we had any standing water in the line...we did! He got soaked...a stream shot up to the ceiling! We finally got it drained off, and got him dry, then went at it.

[Rocky D]

Here's me crawing around, getting ready to weld.

[Rocky D]

Punching through the pipe with a Miller 3080 plas cutter

[Rocky D]

The final result...one of four I installed today. 1/8" root opening, two passes.

The next phase we will be installing two 4" weldolets on a six inch pipe 20 feet up, on a horizontal run.

[Rocky D]

Originally posted by Ed Heimbach
Rocky;
Hot taps, wow, how I hated those things!

Hope you found this 'enlightening'. Ed

Yeah, thanks...a friend of mine said he saw a girl welding a hot tap on a charged line in the street, with acetylene, and the flame shooting out a couple of feet! i wondered how the initial hole was cut in the pipe. Hole saw makes sense.

[Mike Sherman]

For hot taps, I weld a thread a let on, install a valve, then a long shafted hole saw is inserted through the valve, a fitting with a small hole is put over the long shaft and threaded into the valve, a drill is then installed on the long shaft. After drilling through, you pull the hole saw out past the valve, shut it off and remove the fitting with the hole saw. It helps to have a sealed bearing on the small hole. It all depends on who makes the set up on whether or not you get significant amount of leakage.

[Roger]

Air drill or electric drill?

[Rocky D]

I promised more pictures...4" weldolets on 6" pipe run

[Rocky D]

This is where they went, 27 feet up

[Rocky D]

Here's an overall shot of it.

[Rocky D]

This is another area where I had to hang over the top side, and weld the back side of the fitting, and due to the red pipe being in the way, I couldn't see the joint with my hood on, so I had to hold it. This was only about 15 feet up in a corner.

[Rocky D]

This one I stick welded, but due to the focal length of my glasses, I couldn't get in the right place with my hood, so again I hand held a plate with a hole cut out for a lens. My right hand is on the far side of the lens plate, and I'm welding uphill to the left, which is backwards for me.

[Rocky D]

I like this one...it shows what I like for gloves...Tillman 864L drivers gloves

[Rocky D]

This is a vertical butterfly valve we installed...tacked the top with a 1/8" gap and the bottom had flange had a larger gap...no problem with flux core.

[Rocky D]

The finished weld...I welded it without the flange in place to protect the seal.

[Rocky D]

What a ham!!!:D

[Rocky D]

This is the first 6" tee...not yet welded, ready for tacking, notice the pipe chain clamps holding it in place. The sheet metal is to protect the wall.

[Rocky D]

Short arcing (MIG) it in place

[Rocky D]

This is how we ste the double tee in place

[Rocky D]

Here we are getting ready to weld

[Rocky D]

Now after welding, I always double check...in this case I used the dye penetrant method (DPM) to test for leaks....and guess what...a bleeder!

[Rocky D]

Here's a closeup...notice it is outside the weld zone...it occurred when I made the initial cut on the pipe on the bottom, it had a little water in it still, and caused me to jerk the plasma cutter.

I thought I had got it in the root pass, but as you can see I didn't. The moral of the story is that no matter how skilled you think you are, you can still make mistakes! An important lesson for everyone to learn. This would have been very costly to repair, since it took two days to drain the system!

I hope this hasn't been too boring, but I only hope someone can benefit by this stuff. :D

[Al T.]

Remarkable!!

[shortarc]

Hey Rocky really love the pictures. I hear where you are coming from on the focal length on the glasses thing, someone told me it comes with age but that surely cant be:D I got a new pair of glasses a while back and had bifocals put in the top half same as the bottom and love them.

[Hobart Expert Rock]

MR. SENIOR ELDOR WELDOR..............NICE JOB WHEN DID YOU CHANGE YOUR TITLE..........:) ;) :cool: :D ..................... WHAT AMPERAGE DID YOU SAY YOU WERE WELDING AT...........ROCK
SSCOTT@MILLERWELDS.COM

[Rocky D]

Originally posted by Hobart Expert Rock
MR. SENIOR ELDOR WELDOR..............NICE JOB WHEN DID YOU CHANGE YOUR TITLE..........:) ;) :cool: :D ..................... WHAT AMPERAGE DID YOU SAY YOU WERE WELDING AT...........ROCK
SSCOTT@MILLERWELDS.COM

Thanks, ROCK, I changed my title when I hit 300 posts, and I didn't say what amperage I was using....cuz I don't know...The machine was set on 4 and 45, I think. It was going in real good. it was a 130XP with .035" wire.FCAW It really surprized me! Great little machine!