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chas_hummel_jr
10-18-2010, 03:48 PM
I purchased Handler 140 a few years ago and have only used fluxcore wire. I am looking to purchase a CO2/argon tank and had some questions about where they can be filled. I have priced them out at Airgas and Tractor Supply, if I purchase a tank from one of these locations can it only be filled at that location? I ask because we have moved frequently and the next destination may not have that retailer close. Thanks

usmcpop
10-18-2010, 04:21 PM
Some discussion here:

http://www.hobartwelders.com/weldtalk/showthread.php?t=33557

I have a TSC cylinder that I can swap there or at Northern Tool since both carry the Thoroughbred cylinders. http://gaspony.com/

I should be able to swap at the LWS as well since it's an "owner" tank.

What size are you looking for?

chas_hummel_jr
10-18-2010, 05:08 PM
I was pricing out 80cf cylinders, I have seen them called #3's or Q not sure if they are the same. The TSC cylinder is ~$100 more than a Airgas. Would a LWS fill a Airgas cylinder if I have a purchase receipt?

vwguy3
10-18-2010, 07:14 PM
I would highly doubt that most local suppliers or the chain suppliers would have an issue with exchanging a Q size with or without a sales receipt.

usmcpop
10-18-2010, 07:25 PM
80 CF $185. delivered: http://store.cyberweld.com/shielgascyl8.html

The TSC cylinders have gotten pretty $$. If the Airgas cylinder isn't marked with their name and you have a receipt I wouldn't think you'd have a problem exchanging.

Steezy
10-18-2010, 11:59 PM
I purchased a cylinder through cyberweld to start off with, I originally bought a 20 cu ft cylinder shipped full with C25.. That ran out quick so traded it in for a 40 cu ft cylinder at my local airgas.

Steve from Ohio
10-19-2010, 09:18 AM
I have found that some welding companies will not refill competitors bottles due to them not wanting to cut into other companies business or having competitors bottles in their inventory.

I purchased a couple of 125 CFT tanks...one argon/co2 and another oxygen for $100 each with full gas off Craigslist. Got a pretty good deal from a guy that bought tanks from a company that was going out of business. I then went to my normal welding equipment dealer which is an Airgas dealership. They told me that they would not be able to accept the tanks for refill or exchange as they are Valley gas cylinders. So my local Valley gas dealership is now going to get my business.

Also you may not want to buy older tanks above 125 cft as the larger tanks are usually only able to be rented. Due to federal government involvement after the OKC bombings, we welders are now suspect in terrorist activity and must not have access to any quantities of explosive gas and oxygen. So owning the larger tanks outright is now not usually possible.

You can tell where the tanks are bought from in two usual ways. The ring around the valve on top of the cylinder may have either raised or embossed company name on it or the sticker on the side indicating what type of gas is in the cylinder usually has the company affiliation printed on it.

epjohnso
10-19-2010, 09:19 PM
I have two #3 (80cf) cylinders of shielding gas, one I got from TSC, and one from the LWS. One 100% Argon, the other 75/25% Argon/CO2.
Regarding the price, when I got the one from TSC, it comes with a "Cylinder Ownership Acknowledgment and Release" agreement. You effectively purchase the cylinder outright. The price was $239 here, but I had a 25% off coupon, so it ended up $179. Gas was $39 at TSC.
The one from my LWS, was $165. Directly says "Leased Cylinder" on the agreement, and the LWS opened an account for me, and in 5 years, they'll send me a bill for $75 for the next 5 years. Gas was $35 - plus at the time I got a 10% discount as a welding student. ( $4 discount because I paid $375 to the local junior college isn't worth the discount- LOL!)
So, the answer is it depends!
The big advantage to TSC, is they're open on Sat/Sun, the LWS isn't, and close at 4:30 on weekdays. Price of gas is effectively the same.
For someone who moves, I would say the TSC is likely a better choice as you'll be able to find another Thoroughbred dealer - Home Depot, TSC, Northern Tool, etc around a new location. If you have the LWS, since they still own it, you effectively need to take it back to them. Also, if you don't return the cylinder to them, in 5 years, they'll send you a bill for the next 5 year lease.
My question and it hasn't come up, are the TSC cylinders transferable to another person - my agreement has my name on it. Could I give it to my son? Sell it? I have a feeling the answer is legally no?

My 2 cent's worth.

ayers garage
10-23-2010, 07:57 PM
A couple of points...

I don't know about the issues with owning larger cylinders. I have multiple 300 cu/ft cylinders. I run them on my welding truck and my shop both. They are mine. I own them and no one has claim to them. The necks are smooth with no embossed names on them. I can exchange them at any LWS that offers me a decent gas price. I roll one inside, they exchange it for a like size "slick neck" cylinder. I've been doing it that way since the 90s.

Also, keep in mind about the economy of larger cylinders. As an example, getting an 80 size cylinder exchanged at Tractor Supply costs 40 dollars. To swap a 300 size like mine costs 52 dollars. That's a ton more gas for 12 extra bucks. If you can spare the shop space for larger cylinders, do that route. It will pay big time.

As far as ownership of the Tractor Supply cylinders being transferable, they are. I bought a MIG welder one time that came with an 80 size mix bottle from Tractor Supply. I've exchanged it a few times down there and they don't ask for ownership papers or identification. As long as it's a blue cylinder with a slick neck like the ones they sell, they swap them out and take your money.

AtkRWC
11-05-2010, 03:28 PM
Something interesting I am going thru with Tractor Supply and Thoroughbred as we speak. I purchased a #3/80CF tank, new from online seller. I have the receipt/title and such, no issues with the tank. During my lunch break today I ran over to my local TSC to do an exchange for a full one of C25. Was told by 2 different TSC employees that they do not do that. Called another TSC that is on the way home from work and got the same answer. Called Thoroughbred and was told yes they do exchanges with private cylinders such as mine thru TSC. Called the TSC national Customer Service and was almost laughed at and told they canít exchange something that was not bought in their store. More to follow.

mcostello
11-05-2010, 11:07 PM
Asked same thing at my TSC and was told they would exchange the cylinder but would charge $19 extra for the trouble.

Steezy
11-05-2010, 11:38 PM
It says right here
http://www.gaspony.com/purchproc.htm
as well as here

http://www.gaspony.com/UNNACEPTBLECYLINDERGUIDELINES.htm
That they will exchange customer cylinders if they meet the correct requirements.

monckywrench
11-06-2010, 05:01 PM
Also you may not want to buy older tanks above 125 cft as the larger tanks are usually only able to be rented. Due to federal government involvement after the OKC bombings, we welders are now suspect in terrorist activity and must not have access to any quantities of explosive gas and oxygen. So owning the larger tanks outright is now not usually possible.


I'd like to see THAT supposed Federal policy in WRITING, because I don't believe it exists and have been looking for evidence for years. BTW, any motivated baddie could buy an propane tank of any size they like far beyond mere acetylene cylinders, and make a much bigger bang.

Due to the business having the very old custom of renting their larger tanks in order to get vendor lock, larger tanks are customarily rented. Neck rings don't have company names on them by accident, and the larger tanks are not commonly sold thereby ensuring no "exchange pool" because the gas companies don't maintain one and getting owned tanks filled and returned is cumbersome.

I ask my local Airgas what they will exchange, then hunt tradeable cylinders on Craigslist.

SteveK11
11-06-2010, 06:57 PM
when I got the one from TSC, it comes with a "Cylinder Ownership Acknowledgment and Release" agreement. You effectively purchase the cylinder outright.



Has anyone ever had to show this document when they went for a "tank exchange" at TSC after having bought the tank from TSC?

I bought a #3 tank from TSC but have not emptied it yet. I'm not sure where I put that "proof of purchase" document. :confused:

brucer
11-07-2010, 03:00 AM
i'm using a place called weld-rite in princeton indiana.. paid for a lifetime lease on 2 125 cu.ft. cylinders, one argon, other is 75/25 mix, around $200 per bottle for the lease.. when i need a refill i call the delivery guy and he brings the exchange cylinders to my house, which is very nice.. to fill both bottles it costs me $44 and some change..

air gas wanted $75 for a 1 year lease and contents of the first bottle, then wanted like $35 for a refill... airgas is just to high. they think they have a monoply here or something, the guy at airgas said i couldnt get gas anywhere around me that cheap.. he didnt have much to say when i showed him my reciept for the 2 125 cu/ft. filled bottles for $44.00

Tom37
11-07-2010, 10:53 PM
I picked up a 20 lb co2 off craigs list for 20 bucks. Airgas told me no problem on exchange since all bottles that small are customer owned. The last one I received from them said Hohenschild on it.

I think if I was in your shoes I would give the co2 a shot. Its not as clean but it runs just a little hotter then the c25.

I also own a c25 80 that refills for 16 bucks. And I keep one co2 for that weekend adventure when I run out of c25. The other co2 I took in last trip and traded for a 100% argon of like size so I could venture into the world of aluminum.