welding of 304 to A106 carbon steel

[madibaa]

hello dear friends
for welding 304 to a106, with GTAW, can we use inconel filler metal 82, 92, 625 or 718? which of those is appropriate? and buttering the carbon steel is necessary or I can start welding without that?
any PWHT is needful?
thanks alot for your helps

[urch55]

Welcome to the weld talk chatter box forums.
I don't know if this will answer your question; but any time I weld carbon to stainless I use 309. Some guys butter the end so that the carbon is not against the stainless base metal. I have never preheated. Is your a106 pipe??

[Wheelchair]

I have had good luck with both 309 and 82 series inconel.


Wheelchair

[kcd616]

Just a small hint inco is very expensive why use it?
And next is welding stainless to any mild steel will break with much stress on the joint, even if you butter it, it will break under the butter.
Sincerely,
Kent

[Wheelchair]

Just a small hint inco is very expensive why use it?
And next is welding stainless to any mild steel will break with much stress on the joint, even if you butter it, it will break under the butter.
Sincerely,
Kent

Old Buddy that is not necessarily true as we had to weld many transition welds (SS to Carbon steel) and this was on navy ships. This was done on several piping systems on non- nuke ships and 309 filler was used with great success. The navsea command would have never allowed this if much testing and research was not done to assure a good product.

Wheelchair

[madibaa]

thnak you wheelchair, both of them is plate, not pipe. for high temperature service, inco 82 or 625 isn't better than 309?

[madibaa]

an excuseme! for inco filler buttering is neccesaary or not?

[urch55]

Just a small hint inco is very expensive why use it?
And next is welding stainless to any mild steel will break with much stress on the joint, even if you butter it, it will break under the butter.
Sincerely,
Kent

Kent,
Not sure why your joints/metal failed. I don't recall any stainless to carbon I did that failed. Of course I do not do much of it at all. Here is a few photos of a push bar/grill guard I made up for my truck. When I have to push a disabled truck in you know it rarely is pushed evenly so there will be side flexing. I used 1/2" diamond deck and stainless sch 40 pipe. I even have a tow hook on one side which I have used once again not an even pull. It has never broken at the joints or for that matter anywhere else. This may not be as important as piping on ships that Wheelchair has done but the point is it works for me.

Kent, What was the application and type of joints did you do that failed.
http://www.hobartwelders.com/weldtalk/attachment.php?attachmentid=31869&d=1285162038

[Wheelchair]

an excuseme! for inco filler buttering is neccesaary or not?

Not necessary

[Wheelchair]

thnak you wheelchair, both of them is plate, not pipe. for high temperature service, inco 82 or 625 isn't better than 309?

Use what you can afford

[madibaa]

thanks alot wheelchair!

[kcd616]

Kent,
Not sure why your joints/metal failed. I don't recall any stainless to carbon I did that failed. Of course I do not do much of it at all. Here is a few photos of a push bar/grill guard I made up for my truck. When I have to push a disabled truck in you know it rarely is pushed evenly so there will be side flexing. I used 1/2" diamond deck and stainless sch 40 pipe. I even have a tow hook on one side which I have used once again not an even pull. It has never broken at the joints or for that matter anywhere else. This may not be as important as piping on ships that Wheelchair has done but the point is it works for me.

Kent, What was the application and type of joints did you do that failed.
http://www.hobartwelders.com/weldtalk/attachment.php?attachmentid=31869&d=1285162038

About the same weld you made, but after about 5 years the X-ray showed cracks, between the butter and the mild steel.
Then 2 years later the cracks showed on the surface.
Then we replaced both pieces.
Unfortunate that it happens, but has happened more times than nina 9 toes can count on her hands and feet.
But that has been over the past 3 decades.
But I can always make a mistake, so maybe my fault on this.
Sincerely,
Kent

[Rocky D]

I agree with wheelchair, I would have never used the butter technique on steel with inco. I am not surprised the inco pulled away from the steel, in fact I would expect it. I only used the butter technique on dirty cast. The certs I ran were 304 to A36 and the WPS called for 308. Never had a problem with it.

[showdog75]

We use 625 at my work welding carbon to stainless boiler tube. They stopped using 309 years ago and haven't had any crack related issues since going to 625. Back when they still used 309 in this application they had alot of issues and came up with the EPRI prep. EPRI stands for electric power research institute . It is a collaboration of electric power co-ops and manufacturers of this type of equipment to come up with better and more cost effective solutions to power plant issues.

Development of a New Nickel Filler for Dissimilar Metal Welds and Repair
Category: Technical Results Published: 7/9/2009 Product ID: 1018991
Type/Size: Adobe PDF (.pdf), 19.20 MB Program: Fossil Materials and Repair

Abstract: In the late 1980s, the domestic utility industry suffered from dissimilar metal weld (DMW) failures between low-alloy ferritic tubing and austenitic tubing in superheaters and reheaters. The Electric Power Research Institute (EPRI) performed extensive research into the problem and found that nickel-based filler metals showed significant service life improvements over 309 SS filler metals. Furthermore, improved joint geometries and additional weld-metal reinforcements have provided added service life. To ...


Current Version of: 1004916

[mustang0]

Showdog 75, is this application for a coal fired boiler. The reason I ask is because some paper mills in Wisconsin use wood liquor for fuel and some of the people I talked to said the stuff makes a mess in the boilers. My thought is it could cause problems with the metallurgy, requiring use of better filler materials. Any thoughts on this? We used 309 for stainless to carbon a long time ago also, don't remember any failures. Now we use Inconel 82 which has no moly in it like 625. There is quite a bit more tensile strength in the 625, 80,000 v.s. 105,000 psi, it almost seems like overkill for the application.

[showdog75]

Coal fired boilers , yes.