.....the HH180 or the Ironman 250????

[SteeL_ButcheR45]

After using a MIG welder for the first time at the first of 2006 I've had "the hots" for one:rolleyes: Problem is I had just bought a new StickMate AC/DC right before I used the MIG:( . When I started "window shopping" for a new MIG I set my sights on the IronMan 250 but just couldn't justify spending that kind of money for yet another new welder.
I stopped by my local Tractor Supply yesterday to look at pressure washers and as always found myself in the welding department before I was done. I looked at the Ironman and the 180. I've decided that for the kind of work that I do 95% of the time and because so many of you have an HH 180 that will be the best machine for my needs. I will have my StickMate for the really big stuff and the 180 for what I do most of the time. Now I know some of your are saying Tractor Supply doesn't have an IronMan 250 they just stock the 210A well wrong again grasshopper. Most stores don't stock the 250 but my local store told me they could have me one in about 5 days and the price is $1,449.00:eek:
If I buy the HH 180 I can still buy my pressure washer and have $$$ left over:D I don't feel that I can go wrong buying the HH180 for my everyday needs, after all I'm not trying to make a living I'm just doing projects for my friends, my bride and myself!

From the Dry, Dry Flatlands of Texas,
danny

[Clay Walters]

Get the 180, a flux-core nozzle, and a bottle of gas. If you can't do it with what you have every now and then; hire it out. If you can't do it with what you have frequently; upgrade.
:D

[MAC702]

HH180 = $669.77 new or $505 reconditioned (incl. shipping)
IM250 = $1900 (incl. shipping) Your TSC price is excellent, though, even at maybe over $1600 with tax.
MM210 = $1382.77 (incl. shipping)

No sales tax. eBay is where it's at, and these are from reputable welding machine dealers. I think if you can afford an IM250, but think you can get by with an HH180, then you should run, not walk, and buy a Millermatic 210.

[rat4spd]

Our local Farm and Fleet has the HH180 on sale for $549. If I didn't already buy the HH140 and the Dragster, I'd get myself one.

[Dan]

If your just looking for something to join two pieces of metal together, the HH 180 will get the job done. However, if you want a unit that will perform this same task with quality results take a look at Lincoln's Sp 175+. OK, I'll give the HH 180 credit for being a quality unit on sheetmetal thicknesses..

Mac's suggestion of a MM 210 would be an excellent choice too.:)

[Sundown]

I gotta agree with Mac & Dan, get the MM210 and never need to upgrade for home use. Get the power washer later, although I love my (fairly new) Karcher 6hp Honda washer. The HH180 would work, the SP175+ (for more money) would be very nice, the IM250 is a good price, but until something comes out to beat it, I think the MM210 is the best in class.

[JeramyK]

You know, I'll probably take some heat for saying this but I downgraded from a MM210 to a HH180 and I;m glad I did. I actually like the HH180 more than the MM210. But I am only welding sheet metal 22-18g usually. HH180 is great on the thin stuff.

[Dan]

You know, I'll probably take some heat for saying this but I downgraded from a MM210 to a HH180 and I;m glad I did. I actually like the HH180 more than the MM210. But I am only welding sheet metal 22-18g usually. HH180 is great on the thin stuff.


Jeramy,

I've always stated, that the HH 180 is a very good sheetmetal unit, so you are using it in the area were it excels. The HH 180's weak area is 1/8" and thicker.

[Sundown]

Yep, the low end of the HH180 is a very close 2nd to the low end on the HH140 IMHO.

[rat4spd]

Then why bother with the 180?

[fun4now]

Then why bother with the 180?
exactly, get the MM210 :D

[rat4spd]

Bit of a price difference there.

[fun4now]

yes but well werth it. the MM210 is a great welder with lots of very happy owners, it covers a wide veriaty of sizes well and for the home shop it will cover all your needs.:)
if you look at its $$ spred out over the time of ownership its not such a bad investment, i see no reason why one could not expect atleast 10 years use and would expect many more easily. its a solid unit you can expect to have around for a long time. it will take me some time but i'm saving for one, took me 3 years to get my TIG, might take 3 more for the MM210 but i'll get there.:)

[Cannon Fodder]

IM250 = $1900 (incl. shipping)

For that price you can add a few more dollars and get a MM251. I keep going back and forth between the MM210 and MM251 or just being stupid and stepping up to the XMT series.

[fun4now]

the MM251 ..OK cool, but how do you get to the XMT from there ??? the $$ to equip an XMT to run MIG you might as well get a MM350P:D

[Cannon Fodder]

the MM251 ..OK cool, but how do you get to the XMT from there ??? the $$ to equip an XMT to run MIG you might as well get a MM350P:D

The abilty to do everything (stick, MIG, TIG) with one machine. Using welding marts prices by the time you get a 251 and a SW200 your at almost $4k, the XMT 304 Mig Runner is $4400 and the XMT 350 is $4700. Of course you have to add the foot pedal and torch for TIG and a stinger for stick. Just thinking outloud, hense why I said be stupid and go that route. Its only money, just have to man***** myself for a while to pay for it. :D

[MAC702]

For that price you can add a few more dollars and get a MM251. ....
You're preaching to the choir. I've never seen the value in the Ironman series.

[Cannon Fodder]

The abilty to do everything (stick, MIG, TIG) with one machine. Using welding marts prices by the time you get a 251 and a SW200 your at almost $4k, the XMT 304 Mig Runner is $4400 and the XMT 350 is $4700. Of course you have to add the foot pedal and torch for TIG and a stinger for stick. Just thinking outloud, hense why I said be stupid and go that route. Its only money, just have to man***** myself for a while to pay for it. :D

Speaking of which, does the XMT series do AC TIG? Looking through the owners manual I don't see where the setting is to switch from AC to DC, strickly DC only?

Thanks.

[NOS]

Where do you guys get this drivel? Has any of ya actually run a 140 or 180?

FYI...the 140 in the real world, will weld thinner material better than the 180 will. Thats a fact! I own one each ,,,but can;'t comment on the 180 other than it seems to be very powerful compared to the 140. Both are very capable machines. I really wish that those of ya that have NO experience with a particular machine would keep yer mouths shut! Theory and reading a spec-sheet don't get the job done boys! Real world experience does! On thin stuff,,,the 180 won't hold the 140 a light! As far as the Ironman...I don't know,,,but I betcha that the 140 will blow it outa the water on thin material as well.
I have run yer Millers, and they don't do a thing my Hobarts won't do as well,,,or better! You Miller/Dewalt guys need to get a grip!

Ironman 250? I don't know. The MM-175 & HH-180s ? I do,,,the HH-180 is better than any MM-175 in the "user friendly" dept. as is the 140 compared to the MM-135. That boys, is a fact If ya need a machine thats more capable than a MM-175 or HH-180, I would suggest that you are probably light-years in ability beyond most of us here., and oughta really consider a Trailblazer for yer next engine-drive welder. After all...they tell ya when ta change the oil,,, and will let ya weld at 300 amps with a STICK forever!:rolleyes: (Why would ya want to do that when theres wire-feed?:confused: )

[fun4now]

Cannon Fodder
the XMT's are DC only.

[Cannon Fodder]

Cannon Fodder
the XMT's are DC only.

Poop, well back to square one.

[fun4now]

I think you should just decide whay your needs will be and get a MIG & TIG to fit that need. if space is a concern go with an inverter TIG. if you are in the 180Amp need for MIG you can easily make a cart to hold a MM175 or HH180 & a Inverter like the TA-185 or dyn200 keeping a small footprint and still getting both MIG & TIG. for that mater a MM210 and a small inverter TIG is still pretty space saving.
i have a MM135, spec125, an O/a set, and a TA-185 all on one cart that takes up less space then 1 transformer TIG dose. that same cart could easily carry a MM175, spec 375, O/a set, and a TA-185 making for a verry veristal setup. some people love the all in one aproch, others not so much, i would rather have a seperate welder for each. in the unlikly event one should break i would have the others to get the job done. wile i dont have customers waiting on my welding i do have limited shop time and as such cant realy aford broken welders holding me up ( a good reason to buy Miller) so i always have a welder in the waiting should i need to switch proceses, with an all in one unit if it goes down i have no back up.
in the end its your $$ so get what you feel fits you best, it just seems we have strayed a long way off the starting ?? of HH180 or IM250, given thouse choices i would opt for the IM250, given the $$ and any choice i would save up a bit more and go with a MM210 W spool gun or a MM251 if i had need of some real thick stuff, but the MM210 with spool gun would do a fine job on any thing you would find on a car or truck. so unless you intend to be doing repairs on heavy equipment the MM210 should do fine add the spool gun for some real nice aluminum work and you have a well rounded setup.
just my $.02

[Brand X]

I will say one thing about the mutiprocess units over most stand alone mig machines.
The mig arc is generally better on the mutiprocess machines. Different slopes
and inductance controls make them weld with all different type wires better.
Most come with pulse option that takes them to even a higher level
then a stand alone unit. How about a dual feeder for running 60 lb spools
of stainless on one side and MS on the other. Talk about saving space.
Many other advantages to them too,and just depends what you want or
need.:cool:

[NOS]

What happened to the original quest? It was about the HOBART Ironman,,,compared to the HOBART Handler I believe. Would someone please explain to me WHY any time some guy asks about a HOBART,,,ya'll try and sell him on a Miller? Do you guys really think a Miller anything, is better than a Hobart anything?,,,or is it that most of ya really don't know, but are so "brand-loyal" that ya can't see the forest for the trees? Do you guys really think that Hobart doesn't build quality industrial strength machines? You guys really do need to spend more money on a Miller than ya coulda bought a Hobart for to do the same ****ed thing! Am I "brand-loyal"? Ya betcherass I am! Hobart machines let me weld shoulder to shoulder with you Miller boys, and not 1 of my Hobarts has broken down ever, tho I have loaned one of my Hobarts to a Miller guy while his Miller was in the shop. No Miller owner has ever had to loan me a Miller machine to take up my Hobarts slack. There has been none to take up. I personally believe that the guys at Hobart build as good a machine as they possabily can, and put alota personial effort into each one. That's quality and pride in what they do, and it shows! If ya need a blue machine to do yer job,,,then so be it! Buy a Miller! If ya just need a quality machine to do what ya need to do,,,buy a Hobart and save some money. Like I have said prior...If there was not Hobart,,,all my stuff other than the 8vs would be Lincolns!

Don't know if ya read this far, but either the 180 or 250 would probably be all the machine you will ever need unless you really need cutting edge technoligy or more power to use as a crutch. In that case, ya may want to take a look at Lincolns offerings too.;)

edit; Do I have a problem with Miller machines? NO! I just have a problem with those here that own em, and think that they are the only machines worth a ****! They are wrong!

[Lost_Arkitekt]

I concur. I have a Hobart Stickmate AC/DC and it is the SAME PRICE as the Miller Thunderbolt, but it has more amps. If you look at the front of the machine, they are IDENTICAL. I have sold outdoor retail, and yes, the "big name" doesn't necessarily mean jack. For instance, if any of you know about backpacking gear, then you would know that The North Face stuff that used to be so good in the 60s and 70s is crap now. Don't go by the name...just buy a quality product.

However, I must say that I'd go for a higher amperage MIG...I had a Clarke 130 EN which welded fine for me on 16 ga. stuff, but it wouldn't do what it's capacity said it would...or it wouldn't do it very well. I'm a poor college student, but I figured I might as well bite the bullet, and I am buying an Inverter machine with a wire feeder. I'm going with a Lincoln because Miller is so proud of their stuff that they charge more for it AND their discount to schools is less than Lincoln or ESAB...

Point is....just buy a quality product. The HH180 is probably good enough, but I'd also check out ESAB MIGs at weldingmart.com. Dan over there has been the nicest guy ever, and he'll talk to you....plus NO TAX. Or, if you buy a Lincoln from him.... NO SHIPPING.

Check out those guys...they are great!

My $.02

P-Daddy

[Lost_Arkitekt]

Lincoln's PowerMIG 215 is $1321 plus some change and it includes FREE shipping, a 15' gun AND an auxillary 115V power outlet. That's seems like a pretty darned good deal.

So, GO RED! LOL.... Seriously, I don't think you'll have a problem with any of the name brand products. I just say get a "little" more power than you need. I don't know why someone was trying to talk you into an Inverter CVCC machine on here when you are trying to spend less money. LOL! That's a hoot. But, in my personal experience, I have to say that the machines don't really cut it when you get to the upper end of their amperage range. If you think you are going to actually USE 180 AMPS, then, get a 210/215/251 AMP machine....don't get a 180.

Again...just MHFO.

Paul

[Brand X]

f you think you are going to actually USE 180 AMPS, then, get a 210/215/251 AMP machine....don't get a 180.


You mean some hobbist could actually use more then a 180 Hobart???
Wouldn't that be like a crutch or something??? :D

I wish the little Hobarts would use the Miller backend on there guns. It would
open up a whole new world for people that dislike that gun. Even that might be to
much change for some people.

[fun4now]

miller is a bit higher $$ than the HH but its more than just little upgrades in the over all quality of the welder. miller will have parts available long after hobart and lincoln stops carrying them. part of the extra $$ is in service witch is the best in the bizz. many 5 year old red units are as good as obsoleat as parts are no longer available so a small problem can easily kill an other wise good welder. ITW ownes both Miller and Hobart but that by no means means they are the same. i looked closely at both befor buying and chose the Miller for the obveous upgrades in quality, wile as a hobbyest odds are eather would last you a life time i spent the extra $$ as an insurance policy and do not regret it. 5+ years later it is still working flawlessly. yes i welded with the hobart counterpart and was not as pleased with the arc or its dial in abilitys as my miller. i stand ferm behind my choice. but its just that my choice, yours may be different and you have every right to it. its your $$ spend it where you want. i never said the red or hobart were bad units just that i would and did go with miller.

[Lost_Arkitekt]

Well, considering that I'm a "hobbyist" (so to speak), I found that when I tried to weld towards the capacity of the welder, the welds weren't nearly as nice and the thing just had a time of it (if they say they'll weld MAX 1/4"...that's on a perfect day with all the planets aligned). So, if you think you'll do 1/4" a great deal of time, then buy a machine whose MAX is 1/2". That's just my opinion. Of course, I had a little 110V mig, and when I REALLY needed to do 1/4" or up, I just grabbed the old Stickmate. Yes, you can always do multiple passes...but who wants to multiple pass weld on small stuff? What a PITA. I, personally, would go with the MM210 or the PM215....and buy some J.W. Harris Twenty-Gauge wire...that stuff is "the shizzle"... I love it.

I look at it this way. If I was a recreational golfer, Tiger Woods could beat me with a set of Goodwill clubs even if I had the top of the line PINGs. However, the newer, nicer ones makes it a littler easier for me. It still won't make me a pro, but it would take some of my frustration away. Guys that do this stuff day in and day out can use anything and make it work. However, as my team motto was last year, "GO BIG or GO HOME!" I think a little more power is better than not enough.

P

[NOS]

To the last couple of ya that posted...I agree with ya completely! This is an on-going question I've had from the 1st day I logged on to this site, and it still hasn't been answered, tho it keeps happening!

I personally do not know squat about the IM-250, and even tho I own one,,,I know very little about the HH-180. (less than 5 hours on it so far) I ran a MM-175 for an 8 hour session and wanted my HH-140 back. After using my Hobart Champion and Miller 8vs on another job, my pal (Miller Bobcat250/12vs) told me that if he had it to do again he'd buy the Hobart! Not cause it's better,,,because it's as good for what he does and it's alot less money! My point is this...

If ya don't have 1st. hand experience with a particular machine,(ain't this what I've said all along & JT stole MY material?) ya shouldn't comment with "facts" ya read from some "spec-sheet". All that means is that you can read, and we can all do that. (Thats 2 of us tellin ya the same ****ed thing tho I said it 1st.)

And another thing..(sorry Sberry) since Miller owns Hobart, AND there are more Miller parts on a Hobart than there is anything else, I expect that as long as Miller makes Bobcats and MMatics, parts will not be a problem. Whatcha think?

As far as the "crutch" comment? That was a cheap-shot on my part. I'm sorry!:( Some of ya really do need the very best eqpt. to do a basic job...some of us just "wing-it" (kinda like a farmer would) and then just go do the job. Thank goodness us good-ole-boys have basic tools like shovels, and Hobart welders to do it with!:rolleyes:

edit; I'm startin to sound like Sberry with all thease edits.Fun 4 now,,,I can still get parts for Hobarts and Lincolns that were made the year I was born! (1953) Just where did you get that imformation? And Quality? Yer kidding right?

[fun4now]

i got that infor from several people looking for parts for there red units that wers 5-6 years old and no longer caried.
as for quality, yep i believe you would see the diference if you took the time to look, but if you just want to say its just as good as the othere than thats fine you say that all you want and i will still say the miller is higher quality and i supose those that dont know will just have to take a little time and look for there self, just like i did.
i supose we all have our opinion, you have yours i have mine, he asked and will get several diferent ones in return. what welder is better what tung is better its all about how you see it i guess, i bought a TA-185 insted of the dyn200 not because i thought it was better but because i could aford it and i think its good enough to get the job done as a hobby toy, i supose the same goes for all the 175-180 amp MIGs out in the big namers they will all get the job done, so buy to the level you feel comfortable with, for me its Miller i just could not aford the dyn and setled for the TA the rest of my stuff it Miller and victor and none of it has ever let me down. i think the extra $$ i spent was well spent, you think it was waisted thats fine it was my $$ to spend and i spent it my way on Miller and will do it again just as you will likely spend on hobart again when its your $$

[NOS]

Easy son! If ya weld like ya write,,,maby ya do need a Miller!
Didn't mean to pop yer bubble, but ya really need to stop listening to stupid people and learn to use capital letters, commas, & periods etc. I'm an old guy that went to skule. I have a hard time giving much credit to what ya say, when ya write and spell like a chicken pecks! I expect that ya don't weld much better than ya write. Try it again boy and maybe you'll make some sence. You keep buying Miller. They'll take good care of ya!:D

BTW.."wana" has 2 n's in it, & "tiggger" has 2 g's in it. Not 3. You can't be a "Tigger:" cause theres only one... remember??? "the wonderful thing about tiggers, is tiggers is wonderful things?"...and you ain't a tigger no matter what Poo told ya.

[fun4now]

its a chat board not an English class get over your self, i weld just fine thank you.

[NOS]

OK!:rolleyes: